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Working out side Canada

Printed From: Canada Immigration and Visa Discussion Forum
Category: Canada Immigration Topics
Forum Name: Preserving Permanent Residence Status
Forum Description: How long can a permanent resident remain outside of Canada? Commentaries on preserving permanent residence.
URL: https://secure.immigration.ca/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=772
Printed Date: 29 Mar 2024 at 3:18am


Topic: Working out side Canada
Posted By: Mustafarasheed
Subject: Working out side Canada
Date Posted: 15 Jan 2010 at 2:59pm
mailto:csinger@Hello -



Replies:
Posted By: canvis2006
Date Posted: 20 Jan 2010 at 7:19pm
Why are they not paying you through the Canadian payroll like most other employers?

I think you have to be hired in Canada by Canadian business, and then transferred abroad. HQ of the employer must/should be in Canada.....and it has to be employing Canadians in Canada as well.....   



Posted By: Mustafarasheed
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2010 at 12:57pm

Dear Canvis2006

I do appreciate your kind reply.

However I would like to draw your attention that they will pay me a salary through their payroll and they will pay my tax (T4) after the probation period of three months. Moreover the HQ of the Canadian business is in Canada years before I landed and they do employee a Canadian employee. I already signed my employment contract in Canada however after I stayed in Canada for 20 days & signed the contract I travelled directly abroad.

The question do they need a regional office or branch in the Gulf to have the relevant rules applicable to me?.
Please let me know if my case is OK in light of the above considerations.
Thank you again for your help.
Regards,
MS


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MS


Posted By: Mustafarasheed
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2010 at 2:31am
Hi
I need a help, subsequent to my previous query I appreciate if anybody advice me.
I landed to Canada in February 2008 my PR is valid up to February 2013, my wife and children already settled in Canada however I visited them twice a year and stayed for one month each time.

Having read the relevant websites I knew that working in a Canadian business abroad is one of the safest ways to meet the requirement of maintaining the PR even though I'm out of Canada.

During my last visit to Canada in June 2010 I signed a full time employment contract to represent a Canadian business in the Middle East during 2010-2011, therefore I found the option of working with a Canadian business overseas under which I can be registered and pay tax is suitable for me. However, during the month of my appointment which was June I just stayed one month in the headquarter of the Canadian company and I left to the Middle East. In this regard I have the following questions:
 
1- All the legal stipulations of the Canadian company are available including the place of their headquarter which is in Ontario and they are recruiting Canadian citizens.
2- Is the relevant rules are applicable to my case, I have a confirmation job letter (Letter of Declaration) from the Canadian Business company by which they indicated clearly my assignment to manage & represent their interests in the Middle East, coordinating their overseas shipments, duration of my assignment overseas and my monthly salary which is going to be paid to me overseas, and I shall pay my tax next February.
2-      As I shall be absent from Canada to follow up this company business, I shall declare my absence period during my travel to Canada from time to time, shall I show them the employment confirmation letter signed by my employer? Is it sufficient to prove the matter and to render these rules applicable to my case? Or they might make an issue to me upon my next visit?
3- What should I do further to prove my case and to be in the safe side?

Please help
Thank you and looking forward to hear from you.

Faithfully yours,
MS

http://www.canadavisa.com/canada-immigration-discussion-board/index.php?action=reporttm;topic=52070.0;msg=406570 -

Hi
I need a help, subsequent to my previous query I appreciate if anybody advice me.
I landed to Canada in February 2008 my PR is valid up to February 2013, my wife and children already settled in Canada however I visited them twice a year and stayed for one month each time.

Having read the relevant websites I knew that working in a Canadian business abroad is one of the safest ways to meet the requirement of maintaining the PR even though I'm out of Canada.

During my last visit to Canada in June 2010 I signed a full time employment contract to represent a Canadian business in the Middle East during 2010-2011, therefore I found the option of working with a Canadian business overseas under which I can be registered and pay tax is suitable for me. However, during the month of my appointment which was June I just stayed one month in the headquarter of the Canadian company and I left to the Middle East. In this regard I have the following questions:
 
1- All the legal stipulations of the Canadian company are available including the place of their headquarter which is in Ontario and they are recruiting Canadian citizens.
2- Is the relevant rules are applicable to my case, I have a confirmation job letter (Letter of Declaration) from the Canadian Business company by which they indicated clearly my assignment to manage & represent their interests in the Middle East, coordinating their overseas shipments, duration of my assignment overseas and my monthly salary which is going to be paid to me overseas, and I shall pay my tax next February.
2-      As I shall be absent from Canada to follow up this company business, I shall declare my absence period during my travel to Canada from time to time, shall I show them the employment confirmation letter signed by my employer? Is it sufficient to prove the matter and to render these rules applicable to my case? Or they might make an issue to me upon my next visit?
3- What should I do further to prove my case and to be in the safe side?

Please help
Thank you and looking forward to hear from you.

Faithfully yours,
MS

 



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MS


Posted By: dpenabill
Date Posted: 02 Sep 2010 at 1:27am
This involves a level of detail that is ordinarily beyond the scope of general principles and observations most of us can offer much about.

It sounds like the pay is good enough to warrant spending three hundred dollars or so for a consultation with a lawyer (making sure it is a lawyer totally independent of this company); be sure to take all the relevant information, backed up by copies of actual paperwork, to the lawyer.

As a general observation, I would note that the larger, more well established the company is in Canada, and in particular, the more employees it has actually working in Canada (and in particular in proportion to the number of employees working abroad), the less risk of a problem you will have so long as you are indeed an employee, not a contractor. That does not mean smaller companies can not qualify. But CIC can, and apparently in some cases will, look behind the outward manifestations of a "company" to determine the nature of the company and its relationship to its foreign based employees . . . obviously, CIC and CBSA deal with a range of circumstances in which some "companies" are merely fronts providing means pursuant to which PRs living and working overseas appear to be working for a Canadian company but . . . well, I am sure there are all sorts of variations of this. If the company is legitimate, a regular Canadian company, and you are an "employee," you probably have little to worry about; if it is a company trying to look legitimate but is more or less a shell or front, you might want to rethink things.

What qualifies "technically" is not always a guarantee, particularly, of course, if (as I say) some sort of front or shell game is at play.

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Bureaucracy is what bureaucracy does, or When in doubt, follow the instructions. Otherwise, follow the instructions.



BTW: Not an expert, not a Can. lawyer, never worked in immigration


Posted By: Mustafarasheed
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 2:28pm
Oh, thank you very much for you clarification which was perfect.
One more question. Which is batter:
1- to pay my salary overseas without deduction, in such a case I pay my tax by the end of the year. or,
2- to transfert it by my employer  to my bank account in Canada after deduction of tax, pension and insurance.
in other word if I'm a full time employee overseas should my employer pay me after deduction or I can do it by my self by the end of the year.
Regard,
 


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MS


Posted By: dpenabill
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 7:32pm
I doubt any of us here is qualified to give that level of advice.

I do not answer your question in what follows, but I do make some observations:

Importantly, this is the sort of question which involves much more than immigration. There are tax laws which will have a very substantial impact on how this should be done, perhaps even which will dictate (depending on the nature of the employee relationship) how it is to be done. Moreover, there is the impact of the foreign country's laws, including tax laws, including laws governing foreign businesses operating in the country, among others. All these probably have some impact on how this should be done.

Such laws should be complied with and I suspect that will not really leave much room for immigration considerations.

And of course there is what makes business sense for the company.

Many companies will work with an employee relative to immigration matters, but a company which will go so far as to tailor its employer-employee relationship to a degree that will directly facilitate a PR qualifying as in-residence while living and working abroad raises a red flag in my view.

I should not purport to be giving tax advice, but I do not believe Canada Revenue allows waiting until the end of the year to pay taxes on Canadian income -- they require quarterly installment payments to the extent that taxes are not withheld by an employer. Moreover, I do not believe they allow employers to make an election between withholding taxes or allowing the employee to pay the taxes directly. I think withholding is mandatory. Of course there are probably ways of setting up the employer-employee relationship, relative to employment located outside Canada, that the withhold requirement may be avoided . . . but I suspect (one really should be talking to a qualified lawyer about these things) that leads back to the what the employer-employee relationship really is and who it is between.

(For example, I worked for a large company owned by a Canadian for many years, but I was an employee of that company's foreign based subsidiary -- so I was not an employee of a Canadian company really, even though the ultimate boss was a Canadian living and working in Toronto.)

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Bureaucracy is what bureaucracy does, or When in doubt, follow the instructions. Otherwise, follow the instructions.



BTW: Not an expert, not a Can. lawyer, never worked in immigration


Posted By: jane
Date Posted: 18 Sep 2010 at 10:15pm
Hello everyone, Please I need your Advice,I'm a PR working out side Canada, on contract ,how can I maintain my PR status,I came back few weeks a ago, because I'm on vacation ,still going back soon .
 


Posted By: canvis2006
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2010 at 1:25pm
There is no way to maintain PR status by living OUTSIDE Canada.


Posted By: matthewc
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2010 at 12:47pm
canvis2006, that's simply not true. This whole thread is about one of the exceptions whereby a PR can maintain PR status if they are (genuinely) employed by a Canadian company overseas.

The more common (and in my opinion much easier) exception is accompanying a Canadian citizen spouse overseas. If you are a PR, living with a Canadian husband or wife outside Canada, you keep your PR status.


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Posted By: lilshyone
Date Posted: 23 Sep 2010 at 4:49am
Are you sure that there are no timelimits in this case? I mean, if, for any reasons, your husband/wife has to extend his/ her stay abroad...


Posted By: Mustafarasheed
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 7:48am
Thank you all for you feedback and information.
It is up time for me to leave Canada and join the business overseas, I suppose all the stipulated rules are met, however I would ask the following questions:
1- Should I inform the CIC , CBSA or any other agency before I leave to guarantee my safe return to Canada. (I might come back before the expiration of my PR in manner I would not be able to collect 730).
2- Should I obtain any documents from those department to support my case.
3- Is the travel documents have any link to the matter.
Regards,


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MS


Posted By: Mustafarasheed
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 7:59am
Thank you all for you feedback and information.
It is up time for me to leave Canada and join the business overseas, I suppose all the stipulated rules are met, however I would ask the following questions:
1- Should I inform the CIC , CBSA or any other agency before I leave to guarantee my safe return to Canada. (I might come back before the expiration of my PR in manner I would not be able to collect 730).
2- Should I obtain any documents from those department to support my case.
3- Is the travel documents have any link to the matter.
Regards,


-------------
MS


Posted By: dpenabill
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2011 at 2:56pm
Informing CIC will guarantee nothing.

Returning prior to expiration of the PR card does not necessarily equal being in compliance with the PR residency obligation. The obligation is 730 days within the previous five years (or, within the first five years, capable of meeting the 730 days by the five year anniversary of landing, the date the PR card expires not relevant to this).

Travel documents are, well, travel documents. They mostly evidence an individual's status and, beyond evidencing status for the purpose of initially obtaining certain benefits or services in Canada (drivers license, health card, and so on) generally are for the benefit of border control personnel and commercial transportation companies, simply for the purpose of showing that the individual is authorized to travel internationally (PR card being a travel document evidencing a right to enter Canada when traveling from a foreign location, subject to possible residency examination in some circumstances).

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Bureaucracy is what bureaucracy does, or When in doubt, follow the instructions. Otherwise, follow the instructions.



BTW: Not an expert, not a Can. lawyer, never worked in immigration



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