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Sponsoring Niece from abroad

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newfie007 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote newfie007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Aug 2011 at 4:30am

I know the rules....thats why I am so surprised on how CANADA has missed the boat on this one....

1) To adopt a child overseas, one must not know the child; they must go through a agent that charges a hefty bill (over 15 K per child, plus legal fees in both countries) This is the legalized human trafficking part sanctioned by Canada. The child may or may not adopt to his/her new environment, as there is no natural family with them etc. COMPARE this with a adoption of a family member; one would not need to pay any agent money (This is a problem for Canada....nothing to tax).....the transition would be more smooth as their are familiar faces....
 
Imagine what our niece would think when she got older, when she finds out we adopted a child we never knew over her. Psssss....maybe we could adopt her Friend onstead.....Canada would allow this.....
 
2) Compare a family that has the money to support a child family member adoption (thus no burden on the Canada tax system (thus no different than having another baby naturally on our own) versus the REFUGEE Scam Canada has flowing......Allow a refugee to gain status with no income and grant him/her to bring family over too while not working......Nice!!!! My taxes pay for this!!!!!
 
I wonder which LEFT WING NUT made up these rules?
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dpenabill View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dpenabill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jul 2011 at 9:53pm
It is the motive for the adoption that matters. If the adoption is to obtain status to live in Canada (as you say, to be raised in a good environment), that is a relationship for convenience, not a "genunie" relationship, and will not qualify for sponsorship.

If a couple adopts a neice because the neice's own parents are deceased or otherwise no longer capable of being the child's parent, and they want to raise the child as their own child, their adopted child (rather than as proxies for the child's parents just so the child can have the opportunities that Canada has to offer) that would be geniune (so long as the reasons for it are indeed legitimate).

The sponsor and the applicant bear the burden of proving the relationship is genuine.

Where something like this becomes a fraud is when the adoption is indeed so that the neice can come to Canada and be raised in, again, as you say, a good environment, but the couple adopting the neice lie about this reason . . . lying makes it a fraud . . . and of course the reason for lying is because otherwise the adoption will not qualify.

There are SEVEN BILLION people on the planet now. Not all of them can be brought to Canada to live in a good environment. I do not know what the just rule would be. I do know it is not possible to allow anyone with family abroad to bring everyone to Canada. So, there are rules. The object for now is to fairly apply the rules.

Anyone who fudges (lies) to skirt the rules engages in fraud. Fraud is a crime. There is no shame for treating criminals like criminals.   
Bureaucracy is what bureaucracy does, or When in doubt, follow the instructions. Otherwise, follow the instructions.



BTW: Not an expert, not a Can. lawyer, never worked in immigration
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newfie007 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote newfie007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jul 2011 at 11:18am
I don't think adopting my wife's Niece to come to Canada is fraud at all!!! Of course she has to come to Canada if we adopt her....why should we be prosucuted for this?
Many companies make MONEY from the adoption of POOR children abroad....THAT SHOULD BE ILLEGAL....SHAME ON CANADA to SUPPORT THIS!!!!!!
 
However, if we wanted to adopt my wifes Niece (who lives in a two ROOM home, with seven others; thus is very poor) we are NOT allowed to adopt her because she is family and sponsoring family members are not allowed. We just want her to be raised in a good enviroment, get a good education etc......
 
Nope! not allowed! But we could adopt 12 children from Africa, as long as we use a Canadian Agent that needs 12K per child. ITs a business afterall. The Canadian Government is the largest supporter of Human Traffic. SHAME ON CANADA!!!!
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dpenabill View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dpenabill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 3:22am
Foremost: there are a variety of approaches to immigration, and a lot of people do not differentiate much between the various classes: some will discuss their motive, the why, as if that explains the "how," but the "how" was orchestrated by a consultant or lawyer or through the help of a family friend.

For example, a lot of small businesses are very much entangled in many aspects of immigration, the business used, for example, to bring family to Canada under the umbrella of a worker class of immigration. CIC is, of course, aware of this and attempts to sort the authentic from the just-using-this-as-the-way to get neices or nephews or whoever into Canada, but to some extent the Canadian government does not want to discourage immigrants from building growing small businesses using, in turn, immigrating workers to expand their business. So it gets complicated.

And then there is outright fraud. You allude to this relative to adoption: a person may indeed legitimately adopt their neice. But if the motive for the adoption is to merely facilitate the neice coming to Canada, that is fraud, that is entering into a relationship of convenience for the purpose of obtaining status in Canada. Many do it. Many get away with it. Many do not get away with it. Some are even subjected to more severe penalties for the fraud.

Thus, the short answer is: there are ways, and the caveat is: those ways are not necessarily entirely honest, some even illegal.
Bureaucracy is what bureaucracy does, or When in doubt, follow the instructions. Otherwise, follow the instructions.



BTW: Not an expert, not a Can. lawyer, never worked in immigration
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newfie007 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote newfie007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2011 at 1:02am
Ok, I know the CIC web site states clearly NO! you can not sponsor a Niece or Nephew (or even brothers and sisters for that matter, unless......).
 
So in short NO. However we desperatly want to sponsor my wifes niece. We were even told by adoption athorities that CIC will turn down a attempted adoption.
 
However, as a Canadian (who is married to a PR), I can't figure out how people do it. Through english classes my wife has met several people who have managed to get sponsored by their Aunt or Uncle. One girl was 28 years old and came to Canada being sponsored by her Aunt. When we ask these people how they did it....they all respond with the same answer...."we filled out the paper work...." I DON'T get it!!!!!! They even sound amazed when we say that the rules from CIC state this is not possible. They act like they know nothing of these rules....it was all straight forward. Aunt has money to cover sponsorship....thus fill out paper work and wait.
 
WOW!!!! What am I missing. As a Canadian....this confirms the "grape-vine" stories of immigrants bringing over their whole family and all living in a 2 bedroom apartment..........
 
So CIC DOES allow this type of sponsorship....don't tell me I am wrong....7 people won't say the same lie. If there are tricks please private message me......there ARE WAYS!!!!! I KNOW THERE ARE!!!!
 
Next time I see a family of 18 living in a 3 bedroom apartment in East Toronto....I will camp on their doorstep until they tell me!!!!
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