Any recent cases of post-test RQ / judge hearing?

Hello,

Edited by VanHP - 04 Aug 2013 at 6:20am

Thanks so much for your observation hekmeh,

Well, I've written the test in February and I'm waiting for my oath since then. But I didn't receive an RQ (thank goodness!) and didn't receive any invitation for judge hearing.

I have split up parts of the OP here in an effort to separately address specific aspects of the queries posed by VanHP.

First, though, and in many respects this has been addressed more in-depth in the Montreal topic, it is worth noting that for now it appears that CyberHawk's case is not within the scope of the situation described by VanHP, because CyberHawk has not been issued RQ.

CyberHawk's case is one of those in which the applicant has attended the test event, apparently passed the written test, but has been waiting for months, or many months, with no indication about what will happen next.

While how these cases go varies, and for the specific individual it is near impossible to predict what will happen next.

That said:

***It is NOT likely that the applicant will be scheduled for a hearing with the Citizenship Judge without first being issued RQ unless it is a prohibitions case (which can be based on a security prohibition), and even in a prohibitions case, the applicant should be either well aware of what that is about (anyone on probation, for example, should know they are on probation) or if it is in regards to a security issue it is far more likely there will be an interview scheduled with CSIS, or CBSA, or the RCMP next, not just a hearing scheduled with the Citizenship Judge.

***Probably most common course of processing (for these cases, those who passed the test and months have passed since they took the test) is, eventually, the issuance of RQ.

Thus, the odds are that CyberHawk's case is indeed within the scope of cases the queries posed by VanHP are about: those applicants issued RQ sometime after the test.

BUT the odds are really, largely, NOT relevant. At this stage of things, it is not as if what will happen next depends on probabilities. The cards are mostly all dealt by this stage. Even though the formality of issuing RQ (or not issuing it) was not definitively made at the time of the interview/test, whether or not RQ was going to be issued was mostly determined by that point in time. No matter how well the interview seemed to go.

In other words: by the time the interview is done, CIC is mostly satisfied or is not satisfied.

Why then the long wait to actually be sent the RQ? What goes on behind the curtains at that stage is largely not disclosed to us, not public information, but my sense is that it comes down to either CIC is making inquiries or a referral to obtain more information from another department or agency, and is waiting for that, or the file is put into a queue for review by a CIC officer. That is behind the wait. Some of these individuals might not be issued RQ, in which case they will eventually be scheduled for the oath. Many, perhaps most of these individuals (referring now to those in this group of applicants for whom CIC was not satisfied as of the conclusion of the interview), will eventually be sent RQ. This can happen weeks, or months, or many months after the test event. (I get PM requests, for example, asking me how this could happen, why it happened, and some of these people did not get the RQ until nearly a year or so after the time of the test.)

Again, as a reminder, there is also the security and prohibitions aspect, and many of these applicants will not get RQ.

Perhaps it is true, as some are reporting in the Montreal topic (based on what they have purportedly been told by call centre representatives), that some applicants are in queue for a hearing with the Citizenship Judge without being issued RQ, without being a security or prohibitions case, but I doubt this, but rather my sense is that most of these applicants will eventually be sent RQ.




The query posed by VanHP:

VanHP wrote: I want to know if there has been any recent (within a couple of months) cases of RQ or judge hearing "after" the test. Not a RQ issued during test/interview, but RQ or judge hearing at least couple weeks after the test and that is of course assuming that you have passed the test and interview didn't seem to have problem. 1. If there has been recent cases of RQ or judge hearing long after (couple weeks) the test; and if there has been enough cases, at what rate does this seem to occur?

Yes. There are periodic reports of this. As I noted above, I sometimes receive PMs (often from members of the forum reluctant to share information in the forum) regarding aspects of this; mostly, though, from applicants wondering why or how, thinking they are a very unusual case. This is no longer the usual RQ case, but it happens to substantial numbers of applicants.

As I noted above, the "rate" at which this occurs is not useful information. It is not about probabilities at this stage. It is about the particulars of the individual case and whether or not CIC has reason (from CIC's point of view) to not be satisfied as to the applicant's declarations of residency/presence/absences. It is, that is, mostly merit based, based on the facts, not a matter of chance or percentages.

VanHP wrote: . . . someone explained that if you didn't get RQ before test or during the test/interview, it is highly unlikely to get a RQ after test, but might be subjected to a judge hearing which is relatively a new thing that's happening. On the other hand, I hear people claiming that if you did not get a RQ before test and/or during the test/interview, you are "cleared" of most danger that might trigger RQ and although there is a possibility, it is extremely unlikely that you would get a RQ, and that judge hearing is one of more rare cases.

Here too, yes, in terms of probabilities, the odds of getting RQ sometime after the test are indeed low. (I would not say they are so low as to be "rare.")

But remember: overall less than one in four applicants get RQ, and it is likely this percentage is actually significantly less than that, that it is more likely to be in a range between one-in-six to one-in-eight. The vast majority of applicants with backgrounds, circumstances, or facts likely to trigger RQ will be identified as such either in the level-one screening in Sydney, or at least in the pre-interview check processing in the local office. Thus, the vast majority of applicants who will get RQ either get pre-test RQ or get RQ at the time of the test/interview. This leaves only a small percentage of those who will get RQ who have not yet been issued it.

VanHP wrote: what could possibly trigger RQ long after the test? I agree with statement that if you did not receive a RQ before or during the test, this means that you are mostly "cleared" of dangers that might trigger RQ. And if this statement is true, then it is hard not to ask "why" a person would receive a RQ long after the test? And if there is anything you can do to avoid, or at least reduce likelihood of this happening. 2. Reason for RQ or judge hearing long after the test and if there is anything you can do to avoid this.

There are many, many things which can still trigger RQ after the test. That said, most of those things are known to CIC by the time of the test/interview, including questions that might arise during the interview -- in this regard, just because it seems like the interview has gone well does not preclude the officer noticing something that raises a question to be further evaluated after the interview.

See previous comments above about the "mostly cleared . . . of RQ triggers" aspect above.

That is, even though the decision to actually send out the RQ to the applicant might not take place until some time after the test/interview event, even many, many months later, most of what will trigger that decision is already in the file, already a part of the case.

That said, it is worth remembering that background checks are done every time any action is taken with a file, including the action to refer the case to a Citizenship Judge for a file review (which usually means the applicant is being scheduled for the oath, the CJ's approval expected): at that point in time, the CIC officer taking that action will, at minimum, do a GCMS background check, reviewing FOSS notes in the file for example, and in particular any new NCB (non-computer based entries: such as notes made by a CBSA officer at a POE) entries. I believe (not certain but I am very confident this happens) that this includes a name-record check of databases reflecting RCMP, U.S. NCIC, and INTERPOL records.

Again, there are so many possibilities that it is not feasible to enumerate a representative sample of things that could arise and trigger RQ at this stage, but they range from the receipt of a poison-letter (or hot line tip) to an indication that the applicant entered Canada on a date other than that reported or something like a POE officer noting an entry that was just in time for the applicant to appear for the test/interview.


As to after-test ways to avoid RQ being issued after the test: Mostly what the individual does after the test is not going to affect how things go, that is, other than missing a scheduled oath.

Of course, there are obvious things which can trigger a problem at this stage: getting arrested, leaving Canada and encountering a residency obligation examination at the POE upon returning, filing an application to sponsor someone for PR in which there are facts inconsistent with the information given in the citizenship application process, among other mostly obvious things.

All the above said: The more time goes by after the test, without being scheduled for the oath, personally I would get prepared to receive RQ and be prepared to respond to RQ. In the meantime I would hope for the pleasant surprise of being scheduled for the oath, but I would be ready for the RQ.

I m not an expert but out of curiosity would like to participate, I think that those applicants are referred for further investigation and this further investigation is a long queue and based on the investigation result the applicant might be sent RQ or scheduled for oath