Re-applying After Withdrawing

marathon2011 wrote: Do you think I would automatically get another RQ as I withdrew last time after getting an RQ?

No one can say for sure, but given the list of RQ triggers which we do have access to: http://residencequestionnaire.wordpress.com/rq-risk-indicators/, which lists "A3- Previous citizenship applications which were not approved, withdrawn, abandoned, renounced or revoked," there is a real risk of receiving an RQ.
But we don't know if these triggers have been revised and we don't know how much nuance is used in their application.
Good luck.


Edited by eileen - 06 Aug 2013 at 2:20pm

As eileen notes, previous applications for citizenship are a "risk indicator;" my sense is that the probability of RQ is very high, almost sure. And I concur in the observations posted by Vancan2012.

Probability of approval being denied in your previous application was, I'd guess, high, so withdrawing was as good a decision as was available. Personally I would have suggested actually responding to the RQ at that time, and submitting documentation in support thereof, before withdrawing, just to make the record complete and not leave room for inferring that is was anything other than a APP (actual physical presence) shortfall situation (of course this assumes things like your original residency calculation disclosures were accurate and complete, and all other information in the application was accurate and complete).

I say "I'd guess" because there are many, many factors which influence how the APP shortfall case goes. There have been, in the past, a lot of applicants inclined to apply about as soon as they became eligible, not distinguishing clearly the difference between being eligible and being qualified, so indeed there were a lot of APP shortfall applications by PRs who had been a resident in Canada for less than four years. The way the APP shortfall case is evaluated, the full four years is important, and thus such shortfall applications, made in less than four years since landing, were inherently less likely to be successful (hard to convincingly show that one has centralized their life in Canada when they have not even had a residence in Canada for four years).

I go into this to assure you that you probably made the best decision you could when you withdrew the prior application, even though now it is very likely you will, nonetheless, still have to go through the RQ process.

It is also likely (I think) that your current application and response to RQ will be compared to the information in your prior application, including in particular your residency calculation. I do not know this for sure, but I believe that CIC now maintains digital copies (if not the original paper) of all citizenship applications, and will compare the earlier application with the current one.

Mostly, be sure to be prepared for the RQ. Have your documentation in order, all travel documents, apply for any pertinent travel records from other countries soon after submitting the citizenship application (so you have a good chance of actually obtaining them in time to submit with the response to RQ). Have your CRA Notices of Assessment and other proof of employment or schooling, and your proof of interest in the place of abode you lived in covering all months for the relevant four years.

Reference to the relevant four years brings up a point you may find to be a bit of nitpicking. There is no way, no way whatsoever, you have "around 1500 days" of actual physical presence that is relevant to the citizenship application process. There are only 1460 days in the four relevant years.

I understand the essence of your statement about having around 1500 days. But, it is worth remembering that the APP test is about 1095 days. There are basically two kinds of RQ:

-- One is the APP shortfall case, the less than 1095 days of actual physical presence. (This inherently, usually, includes an examination encompassing the other type of RQ case.)

-- The other is about questioning the applicant's declarations of presence and absence. Whether it is 1100 days or 1400 days (up to 1460 days), is merely one evidentiary factor among the whole gamut of evidentiary factors. In this kind of case evidence and indication of a life lived in Canada, the usual residency indicators, is very important; this requires the submission of objective, direct evidence of place of residence, activity (mostly employment), and as to collateral indicators (ranging from location of immediate family to indications about income, income sources, ranging from usual and ordinary ties to residing in Canada like a provincial drivers license or community activities to evidence of the use of Canadian health care or dental care, and so on).

I say the above to alert you to not be too dependent on the total number of days you have been physically present in Canada in the four years immediately preceding the date you apply (and the time in Canada prior to that four year time frame is of minimal relevance, only relevant to the extent that one's history in general is relevant, which has to do with how coherent the whole picture of the applicant is).

canon wrote: Hi, I have a question here please. Re the list of RQ triggers, under Document "C1: ID issued within 3 months of date of application."  In my case, I waited until I moved from my old rented house to a new owned one within the same town. I changed the address on my driver's license, and then went and applied right after receiving the Driving License with the new house's address, all that happened in less than 3 months.  Does that trigger an RQ? Thanks

Yes, you will get a RQ.  Look at CP-5 Residency, on p 11 where the existence of a previous application on any grounds (or none whatsoever), raises a concern about residency. 

I was caught up in a previous VERY SLOW cit processing situation where, despite the fact that the cit certificate was printed and waiting in the local office and website said the next step was for them to issue a date to take the oath, it became necessary to renew PR because it was expiring.  Unfortunately, this occurred in the midst of an apparent local PR fraud reduction campaign.  We were subjected to so much interrogation and expense of obtaining and reproducing hundreds of records to disprove a highly circumstantial inference of non-residence (based on CIC "sleuthing" of stale internet data, and incompetence of several Canadian agencies with failure to correct their own records), that when the RQ was subsequently thrown on top we were advised by an attorney that we had apparently been targeted and it was better to withdraw and reapply after a period of cooling our heels as long term PRs.  Then I found myself needing to travel for family reasons, and then received another RQ after reapplying 8 years later which I'm certain was because of being a re-applicant (read the officer's checklist upside down). 

I don't know that it would be possible for you to submit a RQ with your application since the form has changed since you last applied, they will not accept an old form, and the forms are not highly available (although one might be found).  Problem is an officer is supposed to enter some data before you receive it, in particular a reference number at the top of the form, which you won't have yet.  I guess it's worth a try, but don't be surprised if it doesn't work.  Just keep a copy and obviously update everything. 

Incidentally, did you consider just allowing the prior application to proceed despite the shortfall in APP?  Since the reason for withdrawal apparently doesn't matter, I'm wondering if it would have been prudent just to let it go and see whether or not you were deemed resident because you were, well, resident?